Having ongoing problems at work which I can't really be specific about (why did I not choose to have a sensible anonymous blog? Idiot. Having drifted into this job as part of a very vague masterplan, I find it stirring up all kinds of very strong feelings and opinions I didn't know I had.)
Anyway, it started me thinking about school, and education and all, and what I'd like to ask you is this...
Did you like school?
What do you remember most about it?
Did it prepare you for life after school?
Do you wish it could have been different?
How do you learn best?
Any thoughts you have about education in general would be most welcome...
school days
education
About pretension
1 week ago
31 comments:
Gah!
Right then. In no particular order:
I didn't enjoy school. It sort of passed me by.
I can't say I learnt any life skills, which was compounded by the fact that I went to a single sex school (boys)
I remember fancying my German teacher.
I learnt, and still so, via experience rather than being told.
I do wish it could've been different, lots of odd stuff happened at school that I only got to grips with several years later.
I enjoyed school and did well (it's easier to enjoy something if you do well at it, I guess)
It never seemed like a chore, in the way that working life does. I didn't have many worries apart from teenage crushes and the like.
I had a crush on a history teacher (and cursed myself for not having chosen history for GCSEs)
I played in the steel band - I absolutely loved that!
I was bullied a wee bit at first at secondary school - I was called "Posh" and "boffin" because I'd been to a different Primary School and knew my times tables (I kid you not), but that sorted itself out pretty soon, once they got to know me.
Looking back, I'm not sure how well it prepared me for life after school. I don't think they imbued us with much confidence at our school - I always lacked ambition. And when I went to uni, I was surrounded by all these confident, arrogant (public school educated) people who knew what they wanted and probably got it too.
I learn best with a combination of theory and practice. I have a very good memory, so can remember random stuff I was told at school.
Intrigante!
School, liked it then secondary school came along and it all became a bit too survival of the fitest. My School was pretty rough.
I remember random things, my history teacher's 'vulcan death grip', five smacks with the ruler across the knuckles, my french teachers cleavage, P.E. in winter but above all that everything was new and exciting!
For me school was always about a stepping stone to achieving something better. I guess my working class background taught me to strive for better things.
Most of the learning is not done at school anyway, it's your family and social circumstances that play an important part.
I learn through example, I got a memory like a pescado!
1) I liked school.
2) I remember the learning, and the life experience it provided.
3) No.
4) I wish I still was in contact with some of the people who I went to school with.
5) By being taught well.
1. I liked primary school once I got into the swing of it. I never really liked secondary school. I increasingly saw it as a means to an end, as a way to escape.
2. Greyness, tedium, feeling like it was time being served. It felt like a rite of passage, something to be endured. The lessons were alright, most of the time. I just didn't get on with the ideology of the place.
3. No. My first 6 months at University changed me more than 7 years at big school. I went to a boys school, which was like being in a parallel universe. One I never want to return to.
4. Not really. Made me who I am today: distrustful of authority, with a twisted sense of humour and without wanting to sound like a weirdo, I love hanging out with girls. After not knowing them for most of my adolescence, they absolutely fascinate me. (Or that could just be cos I'm a boy anyway.)
5. I have an amazing thirst for knowledge. There's nothing better than someone enthusiastic about their subject telling you about it. I have fond memories of many of the teachers. Especially those who seemed to despite the structure and ethos of the school as much as I did...
Despise, not despite. Go to bed, Derek.
Greavsie, intriguing. You make it sound all Dead Poet's Society. And iconoclastic as usual, fancying the German teacher, not the French teacher...
Anx, a steel band, how fabulous! I so wish I'd learned an instrument, not just for the music's sake - like in American Pie, band camp seemed like a hotbed of hanky-panky.
The confidence thing is something that's on my mind at lot at the moment, because I don't think school does enough to build it up (even at primary level) it seems like it's a system set up in which most kids can't help but fail - but won't get on my soapbox...
Señor T - Vulcan Death Grip! Ah, those were the days, before use of the Vulcan Death Grip on a student would land you in gaol.
Most of the learning is not done at school anyway Couldn't agree more - but it begs the question, what is school for?
Matt, you are a cheery, optimistic sort, so it doesn't surprise me. 'by being taught well' - it sounds so simple doesn't it? You would not believe the agonising that goes on about this.
Del - Greyness, tedium, feeling like it was time being served. It felt like a rite of passage, something to be endured.
Sums up my school days totally, and I think a lot of people's, especially at secondary school, but why is it like this? Why why why? At an age when your brain is at its optimum, and most kids don't have to worry about grown-up stuff like paying the bills, school should be a fantastic experience all about learning, experimenting, exploring and discovering yourself...
Anyway, must go or I'll be late for school... Thanks all, very interesting and thought-provoking.
Wait! don't you want my North American take on school? Well I am going to tell you even though it might be too late for you to read..
Did I like school - well yes - I suppose minus the bullying when younger for my Barry Manilow hair cut and that fact that I hadn't shaved my legs till I was 11 and that didn't seem to be cool and that I had a learning disability in maths which I had to go to special classes for and tutors for the majority of my elementary years. It was kind of a downer.
I remember mostly the social stuff. I don't remember so much the learning until my last couple years of highschool when I actually did really well and applied myself finally.
I think it prepared me definately for the world. I had been through a lot already with a couple good friends dying in car accidents, being a loser then all the sudden being cool - Drama helped me be more confident and I found people I got on with. I also figured out who my real friends were.
I wish it could have been different absolutely. I wish I had tried harder and not worried so much about what party to go to on Friday night or whether or not to have sex with my older boyfriend who was a total jerk off. My whole life would be different if I had known what I wanted to be - loads of people did - I didnt have a clue.
I learn best by being taught well and some teachers are good at that and some are really not supposed to be teachers. Its a hard job - I absolutely have high esteem for Miss Black.
Its so important for parents to be supportive as well - it's so hard being a kid and kids are cruel - parents need to be there to talk to - and remain calm if you get suspended for a fight etc and pay for tutors if need be. I turned out alright in the end thanks to my mom and dad...
1 I liked school and did well
2 I remember the good teachers best
3 I wish there had been more flexibility about subjects. I loved english and history but was good at science. It seemed unbelievably difficult to do a bit of both.
4 Having had to do my learning style questionnaire at some course or other I know I'm a complete activist.
Just saw the History Boys last night and my school was an old fashioned grammar school where results were everything. You did feel like a piece of meat at the time. They were more interested in you getting good results for the school's benefit than for yours.
I did a blog about this recently. My favourite educator at university said to me 'you're here to be educated, not to pass exams' and that has stayed with me.
My teacher friends tell me it is getting more and more difficult to inspire pupils because of the restrictions of the curriculum. Teaching is one of the most important jobs there is Annie. Unfortunately it seems very undervalued.
1) Hated school with a vengence. Good reasons.
2) Violence, bullying, abuse, predominently crap teachers, though I do remember two who deserve an element of praise for dedication and giving up of spare time.
3)Not at all in the ways intended. It did prepare me for how shitty life could be at times but I already knew that before I went to school.
4) Definitely, I love learning even now in my 50's.
5) Reading, practical/hands on experience, self-learning/study, exposure to enthusiastic instructors.
I loved college and university and learned a lot there but by and large I was already self taught to that level so neither relly stretched me in any way.
Stick in there, teachers who enthuse about their subject, create a bit of magic and give support, care and encouragement are worth a million times their weight in gold. My circumstances were specific to me and gooid teachers could still have made a difference. :)
Yes
Miss Gilvray's powder blue spray-on trousers
In so much as I still have a thing for powder blue spray-on trousers
If computers hadn't just been for spotty nerds in black v neck jumpers
On the job
Glad I wasn't the only one... I feel I should clarify a bit more. I did well, and there were many excellent teachers. I had lots of friends I liked, and still do now. But there was something about the place that I hated. I guess the fundamental fact that sporting achievement and school badge dogma mattered more than a passion for learning and creativity.
I quite enjoyed primary school, disliked secondary school (old-fashioned direct grant/grammar that had delusions of being a public school, rugby, Thatcherite anti-intellectualism... sounds rather like Del's experience) although there were some excellent teachers, whose value (inevitably) I failed to realise until later. I was lucky enough to get a scholarship to a school in Canada, which could have been very similar, but was more tolerant of square pegs.
Remember most... people telling me I wasn't fulfilling my potential. Boredom. And the thinly-veiled threat of violence. Developed tendency to avoid confrontation.
Preparation... not really. Needed college for that.
I wish it could have been different, but I don't know what the alternative could have been.
Learn best by osmosis, without realising I'm doing it.
Sar, My whole life would be different if I had known what I wanted to be
darling, that's not your fault, that's totally down to the school - this is my problem with it, if they haven't engaged kids or prepared them in any way for what happens when they leave, it's their failure, not yours. And teenagers are worried about parties and boyfriends, when else do they get in their lives to think about that stuff? It's the school's job to take that into account - we can't pretend that isn't important or part of kids' lives.
Thanks everyone for commenting, especially new faces - I'll get back to you later, damn, must go to work,(where blogs are blocked.)
did i like school?
yes, until i was 8.
remember most?
the fact that all the teachers disliked my older brother and seemed to hold that against me...
oh, and maths, science and english.
and arguing with the RE teacher...
life after school?
no. no use at all.
different?
yes, but i don't know how, sooo many kids, so few teachers...is it possible to do everything one on one?
learn best?
by being interested, not bored, stimulated, an incentive to actually want to learn.
thoughts?
scrap the system. try something new.
i don't know what, but something...
1. Only once I'd left. I didn't dislike it seriously (it was all I had, after all), but I look back on it fondly now that I've seen how much worse it is to actually have to work for a living.
2. Being ignored by the popular kids (at best), being persecuted by a few selected idiots for being smarter and better spoken than them, and eventually being spurned by the other smart & geeky kids because ... well, they were just like that.
A few specific memories spring to mind, but I won't bore you with them.
3. Goodness no. Well, it prepared me for doing A-levels (I realise a lot of people consider that school, still, but I went to a tertiary college in a region that wasn't keen on sixth forms).
A-levels curiously didn't prepare me for my degree, and my degree didn't prepare me for life (except that putting minimal effort into it left me with the spare time to work on my hobbies, and in doing so gain the skills that make my living).
4. Different? I always regret how little work I put in. In that respect school is no different to anything else.
5. I learn best by starting from the most abstract principles and working in. The details I'll forget, but the reason behind them I probably never will, and if I can remember why something is, I can easily look up (or make a good guess at) what it is.
In being taught, I learn best from someone who loves their subject, because there's always a chance that partway through it'll come to pass that so do I.
But then, we all that last part, right?
not sure what you're looking for there, but i'm a serial drop out, so i'm probably not the best motivator there is.
i hated school, most of the time because i couldn't stay focused long enough.
i remember the parties and my friends and the boring hours doing nonsense.
it prepares me for shit, but really, in hindsight, it's probably as useful as it gets.
i learn best by trying to get better in what things i want to do. sometimes, that might mean going to school, but other times, is simply by doing it and learning about it every other way, too.
it's not useless, no. i just don't think i'm the kind of person who could sit and listen.
Did you like school? Probably up until the age of seven.
What do you remember most about it? The most unpleasant stuff - specifically the time that we had double PE followed by double maths on Friday afternoon. I mean, how sadistic can you get?
Did it prepare you for life after school? Oh, probably - school prepares you for getting up early, tedium, being told off and having to wear a drab horrible uniform, all of which you tend to have to deal with in the workplace.
Do you wish it could have been different? I probably wished that there had been teachers who would have encouraged me to be "creative", although I'm probably deluding myself there. I was certainly never praised or encouraged to work harder. Presumably I didn't have any potential for improvement in the first place!
How do you learn best? By being interested in a subject. Or by not being disparaged.
Realdoc, you so lucky being good at arts & sciences, though you're right, why should you have to choose between them? Saw and loved the film of the History Boys recently, was nodding and tsking at the dialogue all the way through it, especially at the poor art teacher's response to 'Art is just the icing on the cake.''Is it ever anything else?'
Tattiehead, I'm sorry you had such a shit experience of school. It's heart-breaking (and seems to be a common theme here) that people love learning but they have to do it for themselves, outside school. It's all wrong.
Welcome, Backroads. Your school days clearly left you with an interesting fetish. If we learn best on the job, and don't learn useful things in school, don't you think school should be a bit more... fun?
Del, now it's sounding a bit like 'Another Country', which us girls watched feeling all hot and bothered...
Tim, people telling me I wasn't fulfilling my potential Aaah.. now I'm a teacher, I understand just why under-achievers make you want to strangle them ;-)
And I wish it could have been different, but I don't know what the alternative could have been - I think this sums up the problem - school could (and should) be a whole lot better but we lack imagination when it comes to an alternative.
Hi, Inconsequential. Poor Inconsequential, they shouldn't have blamed you for your brother. 'So many kids, so few teachers' - you said it. Everyone knows that halving class sizes would improve things 100%, but will it ever happen? I agree with scrapping it too.
QE, you sound like an outcast at school, it's a wonder you turned out so well-balanced... I think it's great that your hobby prepared you for your job - but again, it seems sad and wrong that school didn't provide you with those skills or interests.
Ace, (the artist formerly known as Treespotter)the boring hours doing nonsense, yes I remember those too, but it's probably as useful as it gets - it shouldn't be like this, oh no.
Betty, double PE and double maths was clearly the work of sadists.
It prepares you for getting up early, tedium, being told off and having to wear a drab horrible uniform Ha! A good point, well made. However, I strenuously disagree that you weren't creative or didn't have potential OF COURSE YOU HAD POTENTIAL! OF COURSE YOU ARE CREATIVE! Crap bloody school and crap bloody teachers! Grrrr...
Well, thanks all, it's been very enlightening. I'll think of you all next time I'm shouting at some poor little mite standing in front of me with his lip trembling, telling him he won't amount to anything...
Hey, nice new header for your site there Slaminsky. Clearly the person who has these tiles in their bathroom was superbly educated and benefited from all the life lessons school could offer. I think, however, not making girls wear yellow gingham would have been a good starting point for improving my school.
I thought you might like it.
You big fibber, I remember being at your house after we'd left school and you, Jan, and Vanessa trying on your old school uniforms. You loved it...
Having not seen 'Another Country', I'm forced to go on what IMDB has to say. In which case, bang on with the left wing politics, not so with the whole homosexuality thing. Well, not in my case anyway. I'd love to pretend it was an oak panelled boarding school locked away in the English countryside. But in reality it was a comp with an attitude problem on the Met line.
They did force us to play rugby and learn Latin though... Calm yourself!
Rugby... Latin... Is it hot in here...?
darn - my gingham fetish has been outed!
I've still got the uniform. And I haven't done my homework...
Did you like school? Hated it with a passion. Though enjoyed the social aspect of a sixth form college which seemed to be peopled by nice people only, perhaps doubly interested in each other as we were mostly new to each other and at an interesting, almost-grown-up age.
What do you remember most about it? Homework. Wondering how to fill bunked off days. (Swiss Cottage library.) God. Clergy. Hymns.
Did it prepare you for life after school? Perhaps. It was where I first learnt a foreign language, and that is what I need to earn a living.
Do you wish it could have been different? Yes. I wish, as a non-Catholic, atheist homo (though I wasn't QUITE sure aged 5) that I hadn't gone to Catholic schools, that it hadn't been rough (at times), that it had encouraged me to think - why oh why is there no philosophy in schols? Or is there, perhaps? - and that so many of my teachers hadn't been so unimpressive and uninspiring.
How do you learn best? An inspiring teacher (or book, or other medium) sowing the initial, interesting seed of an interesting subject (or something you have a natural affinity for), then doing further reading by myself.
Sorry to hear about your work woes. Hope they work themselves out.
Em, yellow gingham, what were they thinking? Is it the same uniform today?
Del, can't comment what with the current job and all...
BiB, I liked sixth form college too - went to Camden Girls, down the road from Swiss Cottage. I think it's amazing (or maybe, you're amazing!) that you learned a language in school enough to continue with it, because I think languages are poorly served in English schools. Agreed on the philosophy - one of the many many problems I have with our education system - BiB, I reckon you'd like History Boys too, which debates all this very entertainingly. Thank you for your kind words - I think the problem is not specifically my job, but our whole education system, which can feel like banging your head against a wall. Repeatedly.
It's so hard to know what would improve school, isn't it? So much depends on what happens outside its walls, what happens at home, who your parents are, luck, natural ability etc. etc. I'm afraid I can't resist the temptation to generalise hugely here, BUT, having lived in three countries besides my own, the UK, I'd have to say that yer average Brit is worse-educated than yer average French, German or Russian. A German pal I mentioned this to recently gave me short shrift when I put it down to, perhaps, a hint of philosophy getting a look-in, but Germans always have to say bad things about Germany. Russians are brilliantly well-educated. You never meet a dim Russian. Never. Everyone is articulate. Has something to say for himself. Knows something about everything. And is STAGGERED by English education levels. (A Russian woman I know was not very good at hiding her staggeredment when teaching English businessmen Russian in London. "Have you ever been to school?" she once unEnglishly asked one gent.) Perhaps there is a respect for knowledge and education there that there isn't in the UK. I suppose more money and resources would help in the UK - I think it's fair to say that the average public-school-educated Brit gets a better education than the average state-school-educated one - but Russia proves it doesn't all have to be about money. Perhaps the UK concentrates on specialising too much, whereas Russia aims to create all-rounders, which includes the physical as well as the mental.
Sorry, rambling on.
I've heard great things about Camden Girls, and know a very nice young lady who went there, having escaped from Holland Park, which was, I think, trendy but terrifying.
'Have you ever been to school?' makes me want to laugh and cry simultaneously. I can believe it about the Russians, but it's frustrating - there's so many good intentions here , and so much hard work, it's hard to tell where it's going wrong. no no, please ramble, I love a long comment, me. It was great, Camden - we had some esceapees from Holland Park in our year- maybe it was the same one?!
Alas, I think I have to see she was younger, remembering that you are the same school year as me. In fact, she is from the same family as my interesting old lady.
Yes, rambling comments are bliss, aren't they? Especially annoying when blogger glitches do their best to delete them.
I wonder if standards are really lower now. My nephew goes to the same school I went to, and his education seems fairly similar to mine, though, admittedly, he has just got 100 A* in GCSEs, whereas that seemed a rarity amongst us O Levellers, though this could just be sour grapes on my part. He doesn't have Greek, as I did, but does have Latin, and, anyway, at the time I was never such a fan of the classics and dead languages as one is meant to be.
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